Non-Transformers: Gokin Machine Robo / Masterpiece Gobots!

RKillian

Except there's nothing that outright contradicts the matrix. You just don't see it is all. That's not the case here. There are dozens of things that stop working if you put priority on a single 21st minute solution.

Besides, I always felt the matrix diminished Optimus Prime as a character and the religiosity that sprung from it was even worse.

But I also enjoy the irony of a civilization of robots having a mystical element, and a religion (though one that has more concrete evidence of its truth).

RKillian

So every bit of the rest of the show, to say nothing of work direct from Tonka, doesn't count because you _infer_ differently from a single lazily written episode. Tell me, what should I look for in my copy of the series bible that would convince you?

Over two seasons of a cartoon Optimus Prime's chest showed no signs of anything extraordinary then in 1986 he suddenly had a Matrix of Leadership tucked away in there. So yeah a single story can rewrite canon.

Viper2

Also, did you know Galoob used two Machine Robo molds (with slight remolding) in their Power Machines line?

The Machine Robo version is blue and comes in a nice Japanese box…

Here there are less color differences.

Holy shit!! I forgot they were the guys who gave us the Game genie for the NES! XD

I never thought Rom's personal steed and that giant tread tank would be made by the Game genies.  

Speaking of french Machine Robos,remember that Bleu,Child of the Earth french cartoon with the Rock Lords and the Green Lion Voltron that was turned blue?

Well,there's a UK Eng dubbed opening,proving there was an Eng Dub of this rare cartoon: https://www.dailymotion.com/video/xiw9c

Rock Lords: Bleu, l'Enfant de la Terre (Blue, Child of the Earth) This whole thing has quite a history to it and if anybody can find this cartoon,it will be appreciated.

I'll be working on both OCs of Machine Robo Battlehackers and posting a God Bless version of Revoltech Dancouga down on the line.

RKillian

There is a white/blue KO of Waterwalk. I have it but it's MOC so I can't say what markings are on it. I would assume one in MR colors with only MR markings would be an MR original.

Any real one should have a Bandai copyright. IIRC, made in Japan for MR and US Gobots versions, made in Macau or Singapore for Euro version (both white/blue and orange/brown), made in China for Euro 1993 version (white/blue-purple).

Some toys have a Popy copyright instead, because the first MR were released by Popy (= Bandai).

(black-grilled Tux)
My guess would be the ~1990 Robo Machine version from Europe.

Black-grilled does not exist, AFAIK. The grill plastic is black, with chrome on top. The chrome can oxidise or wear off.

(Staks with gray rear)
This I've never heard of. If I were to guess, it would be a Robo Machine release.

Has black rear. Australia got color variants as part of their "Machine Men" releases (including a black Battle Base), so maybe it came from there?

Well, business just picked up.  

So every bit of the rest of the show, to say nothing of work direct from Tonka, doesn't count because you _infer_ differently from a single lazily written episode. Tell me, what should I look for in my copy of the series bible that would convince you?

Also, how do you deal with the Constructicons? They have 2, arguably 3, explicit and conflicting origins.

Sentinel. Exactly what I thought.

I'll ask you the same question I asked Club Walky.

If the GoBots are descended from humanoids of approximately human size and composition (see also Last Engineer), why are their "brains" many times the size of a human skull? And wildly different shapes? And undetected until Sentinel is given a magic frequency by the GoBot with a holographic projector?

There are a hundred other points but I'll keep to tearing apart a throwaway episode plot device for starters.

Rodimus Prime

humanoid brains

Says who? Sentinel?

Rodimus Prime

I always took it as him trying to (over-)compensate for some fans' tendency to be blinded by nostalgia. Although I fully support mocking the cartoon. I believe that, and the general lack of creativity on the team(s) responsible for turning Machine Robo into Gobots, was a big reason for the line's failure compared to Transformers. Even if you didn't watch the show or read the comics, you could still pick a TF at the store based on the personality listed on the packaging. With Gobots it was basically whichever one looked the coolest to you. As for the show, it was needlessly complicated (they're not robots, but cyborgs basically) while the episodes themselves were too simple and plain.

Yeah,the animation was….questionable but I've watched a few episodes which were recommended to me like 'Et Tu Cykill','Steamer's Defection' and 'Third Column' and those were some of the best episodes Gobots had to offer and the writing really shows what they can do. Though the personalities of these robots differ from one another other than the main 3 Renegades and the 3 Guardians,they're no different from their Revenge of Cronos and Battlehacker selves.

Yeah,I really do feel there were some things which were behind the times but I'm gonna be with RKillian here:

RKillian

Well the way I've heard it explained is that Challenge of the GoBots was designed to compete in the domestic market at the time that MOTU was taking off. Marvel's post-MOTU take on animated programming and the first serious influx of dubbed anime turned that upside down. As much as I love what Hanna Barbera produced, somebody looking at it out of context and searching for edge should be directing questions at Tonka for choosing the studio of Yogi Bear, Fred Flintstone, and Scooby Doo for a show about robots fighting a civil war. The studio's people did the best they could decades after Johnny Quest and Space Ghost, GoBots is a masterpiece compared to dreck like the various Superfriends iteratons, and their work continued to improve until it started producing shows like 1993's Swat Kats that were more in line with "modern" audience tastes. Even Battle of the Rocklords, the 1986 DTV-turned-theatrical movie, shows a level of craftsmanship that's above and beyond what's condescendingly described as Hanna Barbera quality.

We get some of that from Clutch of Doom when CyKill has taken control of GoBotron. CyKill's beef is clearly with the Guardians and their allies, not the average citizen. Think back to Megatron's Master Plan (which is part Clutch of Doom and part Tarnished Image). The Autobots are gone five minutes and Megatron enslaves the people of Earth. Even the wheelchair-bound Chip is drafted into a work camp. We never see that on CyKill's GoBotron. Life goes on as usual until it's discovered that the Guardians are actively working to undermine him. CyKill goes on TV and tells the citizens that the Guardians are terrorists and helping them is a crime against the state. There's some supervillain bluster (it _is_ a kid's show written by a comedy studio 35 years ago) but no real indication of how dire a Renegade-ruled GoBotron could be. Hell, when Leader-1 seemingly destroys 4 billion people, CyKill yells "what have you done, you maniac?!" When you look at it through the lens of Et Tu CyKill…he was a Guardian, his ambition to work for a better GoBotron was spurned, and now he's a little warped by all of these people working against him. Just look at Earth's shifting role in the series. It starts out as a base from which to launch an assault on GoBotron. Only after it's actively sided with the Guardians does it become a target like in Nova Beam. Even in Cold Spell, CyKill's dictate is clear – renounce the Guardians and I'll shut off the weather machine that's freezing your planet.

And funny enough,Cy-Kill…despite being a villain had NO beef with humans,just the enemies he set out to kill in the first place which is unheard of but then again,I don't think the bios of these cyborgs were ever present on their boxes to begin with if they had any.

Edit: Whoops,they're still robots! MY BAD! >_<